Haha, you can’t move me.
I’m going to grab your wrist and not let you move. No matter what you try to do, I’m going to try to keep my feet anchored where I’m standing. Have you ever trained with someone like this? Sure, sometimes it’s appropriate to test your partner by “holding with ki” and making sure they move correctly. But what kind of an attack is this? Just to grab someone and hold them there? Aikido should be a dialogue. An exchange of energy. When you grab your partner and lower your weight with the intention of just stopping your partner’s movements then your attack has died.
Can you move someone who sinks down and tries to resist? Sure, there is always some way to off-balance your partner. Usually you have to release the tension in your arms and shoulders and move from your center. Maybe you have to increase the pressure of his grab to elicit a response. Maybe an atemi is appropriate. Sometimes this is an interesting way to train, but if you are always grabbing your partner and just holding your ground then you are always playing defense.
A strong attack, good technique, and good ukemi – There’s the recipe for fun Aikido training.
In morotetori, I like to do a sort of “grab and push”. It is essentially uke grabbing nage’s arm as though to perform a sort of yonkyo. I then project nage’s arm through (or at least towards) their head. This is easiest when nage offers their arm high. When offered low, I like to do something similar but I direct nage’s elbow into their center. Both variations provide solid attacks that have good feeling of intention to them even though they are “only” hand grabs. Nage then has energy, direction and intent to work with, though, sometimes they are bit surprised. It seems that many AIkidoka do perform the grab, grip and hold thing that you describe above. What’s with that anyway?
This seems to me to be the opposite end of the spectrum to the “aiki bunny” compliant ukemi. People forget there can be just as much dishonesty if the goal becomes just to beat the other person (competition) and that’s when you get itazura (so called “sempai tricks”) when people can’t back up their “hard training” with actual kokyu skills. I agree, atemi and so on can solve this and it is an interesting study in itself, but it is better if people just give you honest attacks. It can still be a solid attack but we need awase and honesty to learn. There is nothing more annoying than someone lying over your arm, lining their head up for a skull-punch, just so you can’t lift your arm to do a particular technique. Sometimes you just have to hit them, even if you can sink your hips and do it anyway.
I agree! Even after years of practice, some people just want to shut you down. There’s a senpai in my dojo who doesn’t like me to start a technique until he’s grabbed hold and settled-in nice and comfy. Then he says go. As you said, there are times for that. But what about flowing with technique? Force coming from the front, from the side, pulling you up or down? And how about adjusting technique for different levels of ability? Everyone who works out with this guy winds up standing around talking about aikido because no one gets anywhere or it turns into a wrestling match. Ingredients for aikido with a really bad aftertaste.
In defense of this, but also agreeing (as much as I can being fresh to Aikido) I must say as a newcomer to Aikido getting the basics of Aikido, like tenkan (yes, lets not have the “what’s really a basic Aikido move talk) I find this sort of attack good, (even tho I must say, first let us feel what to do, let us know the connection and the exchange of ki, then resist) this was how I felt I reached some sort of understanding, but I noticed a bad effect of this. Many newcomers tried to put up the same sort of attack as sensei and sempai’s, the sort of attack where only doing it just right gets you anywhere, they all failed, ending up with a tense rigid stance and what ever I did I could not really do any technique’s, it was like a stick uke. Now when this happens I usually shake my hand (the hand their holding, the grip hardens, but often the body relax to compensate.) If that don’t work I push my ki through their shoulders and like a tree they often fall. But keep in mind, I’m a newcomer, and this was just a newcomers look at this all. Keep on the great blog
Always keep awareness around you and understand uke what he wants to do first.
If uke just wants to hold and shut you down, then you can stand there and wait for uke’s next movement. It is because as long as you do not move, uke has nothing to resist. However, this is useless and wasting time for training.
If uke holds with ki, it means this is ki test. If this is ki test, you just stand there with unmovable mind. Then, you pass the ki test. If uke’s mind moves, then you apply the technique on the uke.
Genernal speaking, proper resistance is necessary for advanced training, yet Musubi or Oneness Rhyme should be the priority considered for aikido training. Aikido does not promote the concept of “competition”, but “blend” with energy to “solve conflict”.
Costic and Paul, good points all around. It’s good to know that people aren’t falling over for you. But it’s also nice to be allowed to practice the basic mechanics of a technique. After all, we don’t start off with all the answers. It’s a long progression of understanding on many different levels. It’s hard enough sometimes wrapping your head around the biomechanics or the theory or visualization without someone stopping you in your tracks at every turn. Positive reinforcement and guidance work wonders. Happy training.
Today at practice, for some reason everyone did the opposite of this, people was boneless, I could never get a feeling of contact between people most of the time. Especially doing Iriminage I felt like the entire technique was to much 1-2-3-fall. And I keep moving the wrong leg, ha! In a real situation I would most likely get my nuts hit and never forget where to have my foot.
That’s not really good either. No grip at all is not an attack, unless they flowed with your movement staying balanced. At that point you have to flow into another technique. But I’m far from perfect, attacker or defender. That’s what practice is for! Good training to you! And watch the opening between your legs!
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Brian Kagen pick: Thoughts on the art of Aikido: “Haha, you can’t move me!” said this on January 14, 2009 at 9:25 pm |
Eh – this could go either way. In reality, someone would not grab you and make themselves immobile. They might grab you in a way that immobilizes . Surely, there would be context. For example, to prevent you from using a weapon, or holding you so that another person can try to hurt you. Also, in those contexts, a person just holding you, and not doing anything else, well, you don’t need to practice Aikido to know that you can just strike them, stab them, whatever. Then again, this could just be good practice for building strong kihonwaza. Then again, it could be two equally ranked Aikidoka having some friendly play. It could just be someone being a dick in class. I would have to wonder what the context is.
I’m not sure about the dying of the attack if you grab firmly and try to stop the partner’s movement. If an “ordinary/conventional” attack is caracterized by an energetic impulse or just force, so is the firm grab. You (as uke) have to use alot of energy, to stop someones movement. As long uke is applying force, there is an attack.
Just break uke’s grip on your wrsit in this situation. This is actually a lesson in proper distancing. If uke can shut you down and prevent you from executing any techinque simply by making himself rigid it is because he is standing to close to you. If you extend your wrist to him and he reaches for it from outside the range you can reach him with a kick(like in a situation where you would be brandishing a blade at him to keep him at bay) then tehodoki (grip breaking) will not be possible, but any aikido joint lock or throw is easily and efforlessly accomplished no matter how hard uke resists and tries to shut nage down. Of course uke could always just decide to let go of your wrist on his own even though it is impossible for you to break his grip, but this would be suicide for uke if you were actually holding a blade in that hand since uke had to move into the range of that weapon in order to grab your wrist. Should you attempt to break uke’s grip or to cut/stab uke while he is holding the wrist at this distance rather than execute a joint lock or throw then it is quite easy for uke to execute a joint lock or throw you.
In Iwama Style, we practice firm grabs. In my school, it is understood that when you bow to your partner, you’re agreeing to train for your mutual benefit. So grabs should be appropriate for the skill levels of the practitioners. Different styles, schools, teachers within a school or even the same teacher in a different class will have a different focus or approach to the technique. We’re taught to observe the instructor closely and try to follow his example with a minimum of verbiage. Rigid grabs are easy to break. Flexible, even if very firm, grabs provide your partner with the most feedback throughout a technique. The most important thing for nage to remember is to not contest the site of the grab. You have to relax and move the rest of your body to change the equation. That’s aiki. It’s a good thing if you learn to overcome that frustration that rises in your body when you’re challenged. The more experienced a practitioner is, the better they can keep the training at that threshold of challenge for their partner.
It is a game of will-power and who can visualize a stronger vision in their mind that neutralizes/ negates the will power of you opponent/ training partner.
It is not just the physical ability, although it is some of it, it is the ability for you as an individual to not be mesmerized or hypnotized by your partners ability to visualize.
He imagines he is a tree with roots reaching deep in the earth, but you imagine he is as light as cloud easily moved, easily manipulated. Suddenly, the immovable is moved and his jaw drops to the floor in disbelief.
Same goes for druggies on meth-amphetamine, you could shoot them above waist and they just keep coming, but strike the pressure points in the legs, and they go down like they have been shot, or so the reports go from undercover police in that situation.
I don’t want to hear this non-sense of ‘grab my hand’ or ‘you can’t move me’, all you need is knowledge a little practice to figure out how what they do works. Just like a magician pretending to do magic, if you change the conditions for the trick enough so it near impossible to do, so too many of the old martial art tricks may seem like magic but you have to figure out how they are done to change those conditions so they don’t work anymore.
It is not always physical applications, but a variety of mental disciplines too, which is why … Never mind, I have said too much.
…forget it … you will figure it out if you just search hard and long enough.